My take on women teaching (at all).

Now that the church incident has passed and my wife and I have somewhat made up (I told her we couldn’t continue walking around ignoring each other and we HAD to come to terms, but I made it clear to her that I still felt her disobedience was wrong. It hasn’t made much difference, as expected) I have decided to go a little more in-depth on my view of women teaching scripture AT ALL, as in to men or women or kids. Now, at the moment I am still in much prayer regarding this issue, but I find my point of view shifting and I will explain where it is shifting to and why.

So for those of you not in the know the issue I had with the pastor at my church was his assertion that men who will not accept biblical teaching from women are “Pharisees and spiritually dead”, as well as his warning that because women DO accept teaching from other women men “don’t be surprised when your wife surpasses you in spiritual knowledge and stops being submissive”. Along with these statements was the assertion that the apostle Paul’s words regarding women being silent in the church could be ignored because the command was only cultural and didn’t apply to any other church than the church at Corinth, nor did it apply in todays culture.

Now what I have always understood is that women should not be teaching at the pulpit, and this, to me, is in accordance with Paul’s prohibition on women teaching or having authority over men. In reading the verses I see TWO statements by Paul.

  1. “…I do not permit a woman to teach…”
  2. “…or to have authority over a man.”

Now some people have said that this verse (v.12) is a single statement forbidding women to teach men, as the mantle of teacher automatically assumes a position of authority. Some people do not believe this, I have found. Some people think its fine for a woman to get up and preach from the pulpit provided it is not long term and, thus, does not imbue authority. This, however, is not my view on the subject. To me (and to many others) a position of teacher automatically imbues a person with authority over the ones being taught. I cannot think of a single instance where this would not be the case.

A recent post by Dalrock at his own blog has indicated that, even when studied down to the sentence structure of the original Greek the verse is two separate commandments: one prohibiting women from teaching and one prohibiting women from having authority over men.

Now, up until now I have considered this prohibition to mean ONLY women teaching from the pulpit, and ONLY women teaching men, but I have to admit that I am swinging more towards the idea that this statement prohibits women from teaching scripture AT ALL. That means not to other women, not to children – to no one. Let me make it clear, however, that SHARING scripture is not the same as TEACHING scripture. How does that work? Well, a Christian woman can share a scripture with another Christian woman and, if she does not understand, she can ask her Christian husband, as is prescribed in the bible. If scripture is shared with a non-believer then I believe a simple explanation can be delivered, but hard-core biblical exposition should be left to the men.

Now, I have reached this conclusion after a few different inputs from the bible along with other scientific sources. Allow me to go over each one in some, but not great detail (as we could be here a really long time). I leave it to you to do some research on your own and come to your own conclusion.

1. In group bias in women

I have spoken about in-group bias before here. In-group bias is the tendency of a specialized group within a whole to favor the group over everyone else. For example, if you have a particular race of people in a large company and that group does things within the company to benefit everyone of that race. Studies have show that women suffer from in-group bias on a significantly larger scale than men do, which becomes extremely obvious when you start seeing women making odd decisions in order to protect “team woman”. As I have previously stated, the bible is a patriarchal book and even Christian women become easily offended at its words. Since the rise of the women’s empowerment movement (feminism) the words of the bible and the understanding of scripture has been mangled by both men and women in an attempt to equalize the sexes, elevating women to the point of turning them into a doorway for men to Christ and pushing men down into the position of a servant-leader – ie: someone with authority, but with no authority to use it. When women teach women scripture it becomes easy to tweak the meanings and words so as to protect team woman. After all, Christian women know the bible calls on them to “…submit to their own husbands, as to the Lord.“, but what if a husband asks his wife to do something awful like have oral sex or rob a bank or kill someone? Team woman must be protected and, thus, qualifiers and stipulations are added to the commandment that are not present in the text. Sure a list of “reasons not to submit” might sound good when they include such things as “kill a prostitute, get high on cocaine, if he loses his mind”, but over time other things will be added until the list turns into “anything that I don’t feel like doing at the moment”. It has been said on several sites that women teachers often teach reasons NOT to submit to their husbands, rather than teach to actually submit.

2. Contextual morality in women

Contextual morality is anathema to the Christian faith. Rather than knowing what God hates and then hating those things as well (in a spiritual sense) actions that are forbidden in scripture are suddenly reviewed and judged based on the situation in which they were committed. Women judge morality contextually while men tend to judge morality universally, meaning men have a focal point from which they judge morality which does not often change. Women, on the other hand, will judge something that should be morally reprehensible as “okay” if the situation calls for it. This is one of the reasons why the abortion racket in the U.S. is so widely accepted even by Christian women. They contextualize the morality of the subject by thinking “Well what if it was ME in the situation, or my daughter!”, or “Well better that than the child be raised unloved and going through the system.”, the moral offense of the subject becomes moral putty to be shaped into whatever fits the current context of the situation is. When this contextual morality is applied to the church as a whole we find the church itself, men included, start to take on the same contextual view!

In teaching this means that women, unless very firmly grounded in the word, will start to teach the same contextual morality, leading everyone astray.

These two scientific pieces of information, based on research data, confirm to me all the more that God knew what he was doing when He prohibited women from teaching scripture. He even wrote about it in the word! Leading to…..

3. Words of the bible

As I said earlier, the bible is a patriarchal book, and Christianity is a patriarchal venture. There is no “mother God” (despite what the people at the Walmart told me), Jesus did not select ANY women as His disciples and, really, there aren’t any plain scriptures that indicate ANY women acted as a teacher, even after Jesus’s death. None in any official capacity that I can see, though the apostle Paul refers to some women of the church in his letters, you would be hard pressed to find that one is actually called ‘teacher’.

God esteems men before women. This is not to say that He believes men are better than women, but scripture indicates that God has placed men in authority over their wives FOR SEVERAL REASONS:

This should surprise no one, as God esteems the nation of Israel before all the other nations of the world. This does not mean that the Jewish people are any better than others. They are just as wicked as the rest of us, they sin just like the rest of us and they need the redeeming blood of Christ just like the rest of us, but God esteems them because of His covenant with Abraham. They are His chosen people.

In the same manner men are esteemed before women and scripture backs this up.

There are no commandments in scripture for women to be teachers of scripture. The verses in Titus command older women to teach younger women:

Titus 2:

the older women likewise, that they be reverent in behavior, not slanderers, not given to much wine, teachers of good things— that they admonish the young women to love their husbands, to love their children, to be discreet, chaste, homemakers, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God may not be blasphemed.

To me this says two things:

  • Teaching things from Titus to younger women = A-OKAY
  • Teaching scripture to other women = questionable at best.

The fact that there is even a discussion going on about whether or not women can teach scripture should be enough to cause us to stop. Why is there a discussion? Because nowhere in the bible does it specifically say women CAN teach scripture to anyone, though a straight reading of the word specifically shows a prohibition AGAINST women teaching anything except what is listed in Titus 2.

Now I have had several people tell me that in biblical times women were not even allowed to handle the holy books, much less read them and interpret their meaning. If this is the case then nowhere in the bible does it indicate that the practice needed to change! Someone pointed out in the comments of a blog post (I paraphrase from memory) “Where is the go-grrrl moment in the scripture? Where are the verses encouraging women to break out of their shell and to stop letting men have all the glory and prestige? Where does Jesus put out the call for young ladies to pick up their cross, leave their families behind and go preach the gospel! Jesus told his disciples – a group of 12 men – to be fishers of men. Certainly a woman sharing the gospel with another woman seems to be fine, but a woman leading a ministry of any sort is not addressed.

4. Gullibility and herd mentality in women

Lastly I point to these two particular issues that plague women more than men. Women are more gullible than men, falling for fake news stories and generated hype about the hottest stars – there’s a reason tabloid magazines do so well with women. Women don’t just fall for this stuff, they LIKE to fall for this stuff. Women are powered by drama, and gullibility generates drama. The fact that women are more gullible than men is not new and has been well documented since biblical times:

1 Timothy 2:

14 And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived, fell into transgression.

In addition to gullibility is the natural herd mentality of women that prevents them from speaking up when things don’t look or sound right, particularly when other women in the area are all playing along. Women who catch on that things don’t add up aren’t likely to speak up and challenge the problem, leaving other gullible women believing in lies. Take, for example, the teaching by popular “pastor” Priscilla Shearer in which she encourages women to draw or create circles in which they can stand and pray. Drawing circles is an ancient arcane art used in the practice of magick, spellcraft and the occult, and is nowhere present in the bible, yet her website features pictures take from Twitter of women creating “prayer circles” out of objects or drawing them on the ground.

Or how about both Shearers and Beth Moore’s contemplative prayer, a practice more in line with Eastern meditation than with the guide Jesus gave us:

Matthew 6:

In this manner, therefore, pray:

Our Father in heaven,
Hallowed be Your name.
10 Your kingdom come.
Your will be done
On earth as it is in heaven.
11 Give us this day our daily bread.
12 And forgive us our debts,
As we forgive our debtors.
13 And do not lead us into temptation,
But deliver us from the evil one.
For Yours is the kingdom and the power and the glory forever. Amen.

Jesus prayed many, many times and in not a single spot did He draw a circle or engage in contemplative prayer, yet these “new ways” are being taught to thousands, if not millions of women!

Galations 1:

I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

A somewhat long post, but these things, this….evidence, is leading me to believe that women are, indeed, stricken from teaching the scriptures to ANYONE – women, children, men, dogs, cats, bandicoots. I just don’t see how it can be justified except by those who have invested very little time in researching the subject, but call the prohibition against it by the apostle Paul “sexist” or “misogynistic” because our modern day culture makes such a prohibition uncomfortable to enforce.

Though I will continue to spend some time in deep prayer about this subject, I am starting to turn away from the accepted norm that women can be teachers of women. This leads to far too many problems. In my own life I find myself at odds with my wife as, many times, I will explain something scriptural to her only to have her counter it with something she heard from a woman teacher, or with her own belief that has been shaped by women teachers. This lack of unity would be eliminated if she were following the words of the bible that instruct wives to ask their husbands for clarification on scripture.

I understand that not every woman suffers from all of these issues, but I would bet that 99.99999999999999% of them suffer from all or one of these issues. I know that I cannot change how other men or women feel about the subject, but I can certainly can, and likely will, change how I feel about it, and will instruct my wife and children in like manner.

And I will continue to say, for all to hear, that modern day Christians cannot suffer to hear and believe the words of the bible without applying their own filters and buffers to make them easier to follow. They may be easier to follow, but that doesn’t make them right.


Author: SnapperTrx

Just a guy on the internet.

14 thoughts on “My take on women teaching (at all).”

  1. Women are not prohibited from evangelism and the spiritual gift of evangelism. This means they are able to explain the gospel to non-Christians. This may be potentially excluded by a strict version of teach and/or preach which is why I am wary of doing that.

    I definitely agree that “sharing” is different from “teaching” or “preaching” and should be handled as such.

    From my study of the word “teach” I would generally define it as “authoritative interpretation of the Scriptures on how to live.” This is what Jesus did in the synagogues and when people came to hear him preach/teach (in crowds, feeding the 5000, etc.).

    Generally speaking, women cannot teach men about how to live. Paul commended Timothy’s mother for bringing him up in the faith, BUT he also wrote the two pastoral letters to help him grow a backbone and learn how to be a man in the faith, including said teaching in 1 Timothy 2.

    Based on what you wrote, it seems like I wouldn’t fall under ‘as strict’ an interpretation of you, but I think I am still in line with the Scriptures.

    1. Well, I am still in much prayer over this, but this seems to be where I am leaning. As I started hearing more about what popular female “teachers” are actually teaching it has pushed me closer and closer toward a total ban on female teachers in my home. I mean, some of this stuff is just flat out ungodly and delves deep into mysticism and the arcane! And since a large number of Christian women DONT ask their husbands for guidance or answers regarding scripture then THIS is what they are learning! Women are more apt to say “that sounds good to me” while men would say “hey, that doesn’t sound right” when what they hear seems like a kinder, easier method of doing things.

      I absolutely agree that mothers have a big effect on their sons and how they grow, but I would suspect that women in latter days taught their children something that was very much in line with what their husbands told them, seeing as how they lacked the ability to hear so many different and contradicting messages (no social media or easy distribution of books, etc.). I would agree, however, that at a certain point a young man needs to start being trained by men and weaned off of his mothers tutelage, which is exactly what you described.

      1. @ SnapperTrx

        That would be Paul mentioning to Timothy the old wives tales, haha.

        Yeah, there’s definitely a lot of problems which is difficult. I don’t think we should fall into the same “trap” as the christo-feminists do of looking at an “evil authority” and then calling authority evil instead of evil evil.

        I think it is harder when you do in fact root out the evil, but there is resistance to rooting out the evil. The approach is good, but people are stubborn. They’re too prideful to admit to being wrong, and not humble even if they are right or wrong.

        Welcome to human nature 101.

  2. DS,
    Timothy’s mother brought him up in the jewish faith and then into Christ. Different. He was most likely taught by men whom she direct him toward. Her husband was not a believer.

    I also do not think they should share any interpretation to non believers. They need to be an example to non believers.

    I too came to that conclusion a few years ago. Women affirm others and do not seek repentance and do not ask others to repent.

    1. Ha, ha! Trapper…that’s good.

      I just see too much writing on the wall that says women should not be teaching anything more than what is prescribed in Titus. Anything more and she will bend it to fit “team woman” and to fight the imaginary oppressive patriarchy. After all, God said she would desire to rule over her husband, what better way than to ever so slightly tweak the word so it still looks right, but is oh so wrong. With a little help from white-knight pastors, it becomes amazingly easy.

  3. Only just learned of your blog (via a link to “deepstrength” from “Dalrock” and a link from “deepstrength” to here, heh) but I read over the posts from “meeting with pastors I” to this one, before commenting. All I can think to say is that I’ll pray for you to be blessed with Grace and Wisdom, and that God binds you and your family to him with bands stronger than iron. I know that the opinion of someone you’ve never met before isn’t worth much, but I just wanted to tell you, “Thank you for fighting the good fight. I feel blessed to witness -even if only through blog posts- your example.” As far as I’m concerned you are running a darned fine race. (So to speak) God bless you. 🙂

    1. Thanks, I really appreciate the encouragement. I don’t feel like I am fighting a fight, I just want to know the truth and follow the Lords commandments. So many things are being taught in the church that are flat out wrong, but could be fixed with a simple understanding of the word without crazy “adjustments”. It’s crazy that this line of thinking – just reading the bible – is so far out in left field now. I appreciate the kind words. It really makes me feel like my blog is doing something other than housing my complaints and questions and is causing some people to think.

      1. You are welcome! As for the “fighting the good fight” I was trying to reference 2nd Timothy 4:7-8, heh. You know, “I have fought the good fight, I have finished the race…” etc? Meaning that -in my opinion- by standing firm in your beliefs, upholding (to the best of your ability and understanding) the Truths of Scripture, and refusing to surrender your duty as the Head of your House to the False Teachers and Heretics that have so thoroughly infiltrated the modern Church, you are “fighting the good fight”. And it gives me great Joy to witness it. *True* *earnest* desire to adhere to the “Law and Precepts” of the Lord…is a tragically rare thing these days, as far as I can tell. The “Prince of the Air” is a wily little cur, no question. But the Lord of Hosts is Almighty, and even *that* vile Deceiver has no choice but to bow before Him. And now I’m rambling… I’ll stop now, and just say “God bless you” and “you are *very* welcome!” again. 🙂

        PS: I loved the “get Mandycized!” and “What men want” posts. How wonderful it would be if more “counselors” and “lecturers” on the subject of Marital health and unity would speak so frankly and boldly w/ regards to such subjects! Also, the “don’t burn out you husband’s affection” post was very powerful, in my opinion. 🙂

  4. “PS: I loved the “get Mandycized!” and “What men want” posts. How wonderful it would be if more “counselors” and “lecturers” on the subject of Marital health and unity would speak so frankly and boldly w/ regards to such subjects! Also, the “don’t burn out you husband’s affection” post was very powerful, in my opinion”

    This right here makes it worth all the time, effort and frustration. Thanks again.

  5. I sent you a previous post responding to your banning women from preaching at all. Yes, it was sarcastic. You accused me of being influenced by feminism. Why must you drag feminism into everything. I am not a feminist nor was this about feminism. If you must slap a label on me than I will admit to being an environmentalist. That’s probably just as much anathema to you as feminism. Don’t preach to me about worshiping trees. God has already given me a plan for my life and it does not include getting married and having babies. THIS IS NOT A SIN. Realize that God is nuanced and has made everybody differently. He’s more creative than you give him credit for. If you think this is selfish, then I think it’s selfish for people to mindlessly reproduce and pillage all the resources on earth until they’ve destroyed them all. Also, overpopulation raises the cost of living. Have I defined myself to you now? But enough of this. This is about ME,ME,ME and not feminism. I started this journey before I even knew what feminism was. We will never agree on anything, but that’s okay. I like diversity of opinion, believe it or not. Besides, it makes for good satire. Please consider giving feminism a rest. It’s getting too repetitive.

    1. Although I am not what you would consider an ‘environmentalist’ I certainly believe we have a responsibility to be wise with what God has given us to use, as He commanded us to subdue it and gave us dominion over all the plants and animals. However I don’t see humankind as a blight on the planet, nor do I think we could ever overpopulate it.

      “This is about ME,ME,ME and not feminism.”

      This is feminism in a nutshell. “Its all about ME”. Its called rebellion and its no different than Eve taking the fruit from the tree. For Eve it was all about HER. You know what, I will take your advice momentarily and drop ‘feminism’ from the conversation. Its all about REBELLION. Rebellion against what God has said is good and what He has designed us for. Sure, you can be as creative as you want with a fork, but in the end it has an intended purpose. It may work outside of that purpose, but it is still being used improperly and not as intended!

      If God graced you with not having the desire to marry or have children, great! Now use your time for His kingdom and don’t worry about this planet. The same God you say I don’t give enough credit for in the department of creativity you don’t give enough credit for to sustain His own creation! If you marry you should be having children unless God has rendered you incapable. Why? Because God has commanded us to. In the very same chapter in which He commands us to subdue the earth He commands us to multiply! If you claim to be a Christian and know God and are actively working against His commandments then you may want to reconsider what you call yourself.

      I don’t expect you to agree with me, and that’s fine. Read your bible and agree with that. That’s kind of the whole goal of my posts anyway.

  6. This was spot on, brilliant. Especially regarding women’s in group preference. You really understand that part of female nature well. I’m enjoying your website. Thank you, brother, for your dedication and hard work.

    1. Wow, thanks. I means much to hear feedback, as I often wonder what I am doing for Christ, and blogging doesn’t seem like much. Though I feel I can do more in the immediate area around me, if my posts offer any encouragement or allow someone to question what they know and dig deeper into the Word (whether it be for or against me), then at least I know it is doing a little more than I thought it was. I enjoy the blogging, but have been praying for some guidance on doing more than just punching keys on a keyboard! Still, I wont complain. Lord use me where he may!

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