Pastor, there’s a fly in my soup….

Feminism is, unfortunately, the proverbial fly in the soup that is the church. When you see it, it spoils the whole batch, and it sickens you to your stomach. Part of the problem is that no one really sees it for what it really is, so no one really points it out as an issue. I am reminded of this whenever I have a conversation with my wife in which her opposition to something is “because your a man”. A good example would be if I were to make the statement “I don’t think it’s a sin for a man to look at a beautiful woman and think she is beautiful, even if she is in a bathing suit, or even naked.” (referencing, perhaps, art). Her response would be “well of course you would think that, because your a man.”. Feminism has attempted to make men and women equal by saying there are no differences between the two except those imposed by society. If society can delete those differences then true equality can be reached. This same sentiment seems to be rampant amongst the church, as both men and women seek to delete the differences between the two sexes put in place by God.

Christianity is a patriarchal venture, of that there is no doubt. God is our father, Jesus is his son. God gave man dominion over the earth. He made woman for man, and gave man authority over woman (his wife). He says man should not be put under the authority of a woman and the majority of figures He uses to accomplish His work in the bible are men (with some exceptions, of course, but when you make the rules, you can make the exceptions as well).

Modern Christian men and women work hard to eliminate the differences in the sexes by marching out feminist mantra without even recognizing it. Case in point: my wife. Without realizing it she is attempting to negate men and women by building on the idea that men and women have no difference in the eyes of God. Though the bible does say that:

Galatians 3:28

There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

but this refers to the kingdom of heaven, as the bible makes clear distinctions between male and female, Jew and Gentile, slave and free while on the earth. The conversation I had with my wife shown above doesn’t really explain well how this works, but another one of our conversations does – the conversation on male headship. It typically looks like this:

  1. I believe that when the bible says that women are to submit to their husbands in EVERYTHING, it means EVERYTHING. From big decisions to small, from buying a car to what color to paint the walls: EVERYTHING means EVERYTHING.
  2. My wife believes Paul (who wrote the instruction for wives to submit to their husbands) hated women and that EVERYTHING does not mean EVERYTHING.
  3. I tell her that her belief does not coincide with scripture.
  4. She responds: “Of course you think that, your a man.”

The implication, of course, is that me, being a man, would benefit from MY interpretation of scripture (a literal interpretation) so naturally I would say that MY interpretation (which is not an interpretation at all, but a literal reading) is correct. In her mind it has nothing to do with the fact that I am reading THE EXACT WORDS FROM THE SCRIPTURE. Unfortunately a lot of Christian men would tell me the same thing, or give me some excuse as to why any scriptures placing men above women are no longer relevant. By doing this they are doing twofold damage. Not only are the disregarding the word of God, but they are essentially dropping their responsibility of authority. If we look into the word, we can see how God views those who shirk their authority:

Matthew 25:26-30

26 “His master replied, ‘You wicked, lazy servant! So you knew that I harvest where I have not sown and gather where I have not scattered seed? 27 Well then, you should have put my money on deposit with the bankers, so that when I returned I would have received it back with interest.

28 “‘So take the bag of gold from him and give it to the one who has ten bags. 29 For whoever has will be given more, and they will have an abundance. Whoever does not have, even what they have will be taken from them. 30 And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

We see here in these verses a servant who was given responsibility and authority over the money his master had given him. Rather than use that authority as he was supposed to he squandered it and took the easy road by burying what he had been given, thus ditching his responsibility and the authority given him. I don’t know about you, but I would much rather hear “well done, good and faithful servant’ rather than “you wicked, lazy servant!”.

What then is the solution? How do we combat the rising tide of feminism in the church when those who are supposed to be fighting it don’t even see it! Even if it were exposed, these men and women would likely have you thrown out on your ear before believing that the word says what it means, and doesn’t need an ‘interpretation’. They get indignant at any mention of women being subject to men in ALL things. An interesting little story to go with that is this:

I was recently at a Tuesday night men’s group and we were discussing Abram and Sarai and their travels through Egypt. Now our group isn’t very big, maybe six to eight guys, but there is one guy who I am slightly familiar with, who is very quiet. I have spoken to him before during his very first visit to the men’s group (I had actually not been visiting the group for quite some time. This was, maybe, my second or third visit since returning, but my first time seeing him again in over a year or so) and I know him to be a somewhat meek person.

Anyhow, as we were talking we, naturally, arrived at the part of the book where Abram tells his wife to lie and tell everyone she is his sister so he doesn’t get killed. The pharaoh of Egypt takes a fancy to her and takes off with her to become his bride. He gives Abram a bunch of gifts (likely to pay for Sarai, as he thought she was Abrams sister) and is very likely on the way to marrying her when the Lord inflicts him and his household with ‘serious disease’. It doesn’t say how the pharaoh finds out, but word gets out that Sarai is Abrams wife and pharaoh, naturally, gets bent out of shape and tells Abram to get his things and get out of dodge.

During our discussion on this I had mentioned that during the entire story we never hear anything about Sarai spilling the beans on her husband (though now that I think about it, it may have been her that eventually told the pharaoh, but it doesn’t say for sure). She goes along with his plan in obedience even to the point that they pharaoh had paid her dowry and NOWHERE DOES IT SAY SHE SPOKE A WORD. Being held up in the new testament as a example of faith and obedience I stated that she did as her husband had told her, likely relying on her faith in God to resolve the situation, but still maintaining her obedience to her husband as she should.

Well the quite guy couldn’t handle that. Despite having not said a single word the entire evening beyond ‘hi’ he immediately spoke up in her defense, stating that there was no way he could see a woman behaving like that.

Now before we could go further the group leader moved us on to the next set of verses, but I tell this story as an example of the reactions received from people in the church when you even hint at a woman being THAT submissive and obedient to her husband.

I guess it depends on what your definition of EVERYTHING is. Everything being everything, or everything being everything EXCEPT that.

“Yes,” the pastor replied, “and it looks like it’s doing the backstroke.”



Author: SnapperTrx

Just a guy on the internet.

10 thoughts on “Pastor, there’s a fly in my soup….”

  1. this is where it is beneficial for a girl to have a wise father from whom a young man must have his permission to marry her. if the young man is going to be/become a micro-manager-evil-dude, her father would pick up on that and guide her away from him. a wise father would know his daughter well and know the kind of man with whom she would be well suited.

    i don’t think a husband needs to pick out which brand of tampons she uses, though, i imagine, he certainly has that right. or to require her to write with her left hand when she is right-handed. or to care whether she uses blue or black ink when one is not required over the other. or to care which knife she prefers when chopping vegetables.

    but there are things men care about, and their wives should submit to those. for example, within reason, my first husband totally trusted me with design and decor decisions. i’m really good at that stuff, and we had similar tastes … and he knew i was good. my now-husband, not so much. i haven’t quite figured out where that distrust (for lack of a better word at this moment) comes from, but he cares. a lot. so i don’t make any decor or design choices without his approval. frustratingly, he is very slow in making these decisions, but that does not give me the freedom to jump ahead of him.

    otoh, there are decisions i can make without his approval b/c he’s already given me the blanket approval ahead of time. he doesn’t care what i buy at the grocery store, what i cook for dinner, etc. if he wants something we don’t have or i don’t usually keep or make, he requests it. usually i can comply (somethings i don’t cook well, although i’ve tried, so he’s outa luck there … we just go out to restaurants where they do cook those things well.)

    the multiple times Abram had Sari lie about their marriage are interesting to me … and it is very poignant that God includes them in the Bible … and very important. yes, we wives are to submit to our husbands even when we know they’re screwing up … without pitching a fit or making him ‘pay’. (not talking about immoral or illegal stuff. i would not kill a person if my husband asked me to, although he wouldn’t. i wouldn’t become a stripper if he asked me to, although he wouldn’t.)

    btw … just curious … does your wife read your blog?

  2. No, my wife does not care for my online activities. She is active on Facebook (of course), but doesn’t give much care to what I do online.

    What I should have included in my post, and I think I may have said this before in another post, is that as Christian men our authority should be tempered with the love of Christ. We are to emulate him in the care and direction of our families. Now, that doesn’t mean that because a man is not a Christian that his wife should be disobedient. The bible is also very clear on a Christian wife’s duty to her unsaved husband, but I would never agree that a wife should follow her husbands requests if they are against Gods specific restrictions. Killing, stealing, bearing false witness, these are specifically spoken against by God and if a wife were asked by her husband to engage in this activity she should respectfully decline. If the request persists then she should follow biblical protocol and respectfully confront her husband with witnesses and so on (or, in some cases, with the police!).

    Personally, as a Christian husband, I don’t feel the need to control every aspect of my wife’s life, she is a capable woman. Where I have issue is when she makes it seem as though I have ‘overstepped my bounds’ and asked her to do something, or worse, TOLD her to do something, that she feels I have no authority over. The fact of the matter is, however, I DO have authority over (and again, I am pointing back to the word) EVERYTHING. I do not utilize this authority in a cruel or sadistic manner. I do not micro-manage her life, nor do I know of any Christian husbands who do, but I know plenty of Christian wives who would be more than happy to let their husbands know, quite loudly, when they have ‘overstepped their bounds’, and it is to that which I am speaking. Unfortunately those same men, recently berated, would agree that they deserved it, and berate me in return for telling them that, no, they don’t.

    1. my husband will read sports online! he’ll read what i write if i direct him to it, and sometimes i’ll read it to him, but he often says, “I already know that.” i love him … but reading is not his thing. we enjoy when i read him stuff that interests me, like this. he doesn’t care for fb, but i love it b/c i get to keep up with so many whom i love who are scattered all over the states and some int’l.

      i appreciate what you wrote about Christian husbands. my personal experience with abusive husbands have been ones who professed to be Christian. however, i know very few Christian wives who truly love and respect and submit to their husbands. my first husband would hit more marks on the Christian Husband Chart than my now-husband, but my husband now knows how to love more like Christ than my first ever figured out … which actually makes me very sad.

      what i think (*think* b/c i’m not a man, so i can’t exactly say that *this* is what the man is thinking or who he is) i’ve seen is that weak Christian men try to rule with a steel rod, demanding obedience, and making them ‘pay’ if they don’t reactively obey without question while acting like they want to … in other words, it makes no difference what she thinks or feels. the absolutely only thing that matters to these men is that she obey, she obey immediately, and she obey without ever questioning. ever. e.v.e.r. and he is never wrong. ever. ever. regardless of what it is, she is always at fault.

      with my first husband i could never get it right. it was damned if i do, damned if i don’t. the ‘rules’ changed constantly, so i never knew what to do, and when i guessed wrong i paid, dearly. and there was never forgiveness. i’ve actually been thinking about this a lot lately, and i think he would have benefited hugely from the manosphere, but our marriage ended about when it was starting up, and since then he’s passed away.

      yes, you have authority over your wife regardless of whether she recognizes it or accepts it, or not. that authority is not always something we *want* … but i believe it is hardwired into us, as females, to be something we absolutely need. i need my husband’s authority in our home, even when i don’t like it. i believe our fathers first, and then our husbands, provide us with a covering … one they are hardwired to provide, and one we are hardwired to need.

      you are right … everything means EVERYthing.

  3. Ame,

    Unfortunately, with Christianity, it’s not difficult to ‘fake the funk’ as my pastor likes to say. You can’t fake it forever, as other Christians will see the fruits of your life and will be able to see through the ruse, but generally good people can often times pull off the look and feel of a Christian without actually being one. I have a good friend who married her husband under the guise that he was a bible believing, rock solid Christian only to find out now, years later, that he has suddenly decided he isn’t. He no longer believes and feels that evolution has disproven the existence of a grand designer because, you know, scientists know better.

    As Christian husbands we should try as best he can to be consistent. Our God is not a god of confusion, and we shouldn’t be promoting confusion in our households. I just had a run in with this issue with my son, who said he was confused over the order of priorities between his household chores and his homework. I had to give him an answer with absolute clarity so was able to do what was required of him.

    As Christian husbands we should exhibit forgiveness. This doesn’t mean we should not apply discipline where needed, but a marriage without forgiveness is one that will not last. We are to forgive as we have been forgiven. I am reminded of the parable in which the man owed the king much money (Matthew 18:21-35), and the king was going to punish him until the man begged for mercy. The king, having sympathy was merciful and forgave the man of the entire debt, which was a substantial amount. Once forgiven the man ran into someone who owed him a pittance and he threatened the man who owed him and had him thrown in prison! When the king found out he was angry and “delivered him to the torturers until he should pay all that was due to him”. Can you imagine standing before the almighty God and hearing that, being unforgiving of those who owe you so little in comparison to what you have been forgiven of, YOU will be delivered to the torturers until YOU should pay all that was due? To quote the great philosopher Freddie Mercury: “thunderbolts and lighting, very, VERY frightening!”. Not just husbands, but Christians would do well to remember these verses (the Matthew ones, not the Bohemian Rhapsody ones) if they feel they have the right to hold a grudge against someone. Naturally, forgiving someone does not mean you trust them. Repeated failures of trust result in not being a trustworthy person, and the bible does not say its wrong to distrust someone.

    On that note, I feel as though ‘distrust’ could be the real reason behind so many women acting in rebellion. Some women, such as yourself, have suffered at the hands of men, and so have built up a distrust of them. Others hear horror stories created by women who have been hurt (probably the entire foundation of the feminist movement is built up on horror stories, real or perceived), and, unfortunately because women empathize so well with one another they feel they THEMSELVES have suffered as their sisters have, and then find the need to distrust men.

    Fortunately some women such as yourself find solace in trusting in their heavenly Father and, despite the slights of the past, and come to find that His ways are best.

    1. wow. you have hit the mark on so many things. thank you for the time and thought.

      in deference to this being your space, I will respond to these further on my personal blog. thanks for the link to dalrock.

  4. You certainly do make it seem that being a woman is a breeze. After all, you don’t have to make decisions, teach anybody anything of importance or even think! Just plaster that vacuous smile on your face and let some man do all the heavy lifting for you. And of course keep having those back to back babies(which is something any street dog can do) and ladies! don’t forget to be in a constant state of reverence for your husband for having to bear the heartache of being constantly in control.
    But seriously, it’s obvious that your “faith”convictions have everything to do with your personal agenda and nothing to do with the Bible. You exhibit all the traits that a white supremacist would have(narcissism, insecurity, fear of losing control) but it’s directed toward women instead of minorities. The Bible is merely a convenient place to hang your neurotic hat. Luckily, the world will never change to accommodate your irrationality. I am certainly not threatened by you and your (favorite word alert) minions, because you have zero effect on how I choose to live my life. Thankfully, it’s not carting my freight train of babies down the sidewalk. Oh yeah, and feel free to delete this post because I know you will Your type can never handle dissention, especially from a (gasp) women. You’re more interested in preaching to your own dissonant choir than anything else.
    At least I own my attitude rather than having to palm it off on the God who you really don’t seem to understand.

    1. “At least I own my attitude rather than having to palm it off on the God who you really don’t seem to understand”

      Actually, it would appear you are the one who does not understand. Are you a believer? Have you given your life to Christ and studied the bible or are you simply spouting words out of anger because you are a woman and I do not support the cause of feminism or “equality” between the sexes?

      The words of the bible are foolishness to those who do not know Christ. If you are not a believer I don’t expect any of what I say to make sense to you because it simply won’t. You have been raised in a society that says men and women are interchangeable depending on how they are raised, that there is no difference between the two except when one is taught to like blue and the other pink. The bible says man and woman were created with intentional differences, and that man was made to rule over woman with authority filtered through the love of God. Not as a harsh taskmaster, but as one who knows when to lead with a heavier hand or a lighter touch. If you don’t know the love of Christ then this makes no sense to you because you don’t know the love of Christ.

      The world ALWAYS changes to accommodate irrationality, it is God who does not change to meet the irrationality of the world. Even now the world is changing what it once considered good and moral into what it now calls evil and vice versa, but the word of God never changes.

      I’m not going to delete your post. I have no reason to. I accept all discussion here, dissenting or not, so long as it is intelligent and well behaved. Your anger is understood because I understand where you are. Both men and women have been raised with feminism, and feminism is opposition to the Word of God.

      I certainly hope you find happiness in your life decisions, and I am, personally, glad I have no say in them. That being said, I hope that, if you do not know Christ, you some day find Him, and come to know His love, and that the plans and designs He made for us are not to hinder us, but to help us, and, though they can be tough to live out in our lives, are a joy.

  5. Yes, my post was sarcastic. God may not approve. Just know this: I am NOT a feminist. I have misgivings about some feminist practices myself. I believe in equal rights regardless of gender, race or ethnicity. If this makes me a feminist in your eyes, so be it. God is not up there with one cookie cutter for men and another for women. Give him credit for being more nuanced than that. If he can make people who are physically intergendered then he can certainly make people with different brain physiology, even within their own gender. I have different brain physiology(as well as aspergers).
    I have never married nor do I have any children. I have no regrets. Frankly, it would be stifling to just have babies and do housework. It would seem like prison. No mental stimulation. You know what they say about the brain: use it or lose it.
    I see that you create. I do too. I like to write satire and am gifted in art. I do not have any right to tell you how to live your life. If you have found a woman who agrees with your thinking, have at it. If you want to criticize me, have at it too. You go your way and I’ll go mine.

Leave a Reply

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in: Logo

You are commenting using your account. Log Out /  Change )

Google+ photo

You are commenting using your Google+ account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )


Connecting to %s